why is thames pronounced tems

Thames the breaks. Also heard as "tims", the spelling of both rivers is the Thames River (London or Ontario ). Is it the Thames river or the River Thames? Refresh | Now Latin is a dead language not worth learning, and so now we have learned, influential, authoritative people saying ECK-CETERA instead of ET-CETERA. actually it's more like jag-u-a than jag-u-are. But I have been told by frequent users of this term that it's ya'll, which makes no sense to me at all because the apostrophe is supposed to take the place of the missing letter(s). It was made up by someone from Essex trying to spell river (or cold blue wobbly thing as it's known here). document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); Prescriptive Grammar and Standard English, Singapore English/ Singlish Vs StandardEnglish, "Isnt it?" LondiniumAncient Romans founded a port and trading settlement called Londinium in 43 A.D., and a few years later a bridge was constructed across the Thames to facilitate commerce and troop movements. What I had always assumed to be true (I think I was told this by my German teacher): Don't you just hate those Jaguar commercials? I always thought I was being correct to say suh-calk-es, but someone told me they say SEE-cawk-uhs. Because theres so much contact between the two continents, we compare the ocean to a pond. No advertising or spamming is permitted. I've been to Heysham a few times. I have an ancestor who went from Venice to England in the late 1500s. Train travel in Britain on the day of a scheduled strike, London to Dover to Calais to London in a Day, Oyster Card for Kids 11-15 from Heathrow to London City, Help with 9 days itinerary - London and (?where else), Travel from Heathrow airport to London City Airport quickly. I knew a co-worker who would pronounce it that way, and he would also say eckspecially for especially. Lunatics. Simply put, the river's name has always been pronounced 'tems', with a simple 't' sound. Its taken from the Latin pavimentum, which means trodden down floor. Trodden on because its for pedestrians. and "Is it?" He must have concluded that Thames (like James) would be a more suitable pronunication than (like Tims). I've only heard it a few times, but I just love it! For medical advice, always consult your medical doctor. I LOVE Ho-ho-kus (that's how they spell it!) Search, "Poetry is an echo, asking a shadow to dance.". Coming from Hanover he spoke virtually no English, he tried to pronounce the name of the river running through the City, but always ended up referring to it as de Temms". At 215 miles (346 km), it is the longest river entirely in England and the second-longest in the United Kingdom, after the River Severn. I forgot what she looked like so I Google imaged her and shes pretty hot! (LogOut/ The British copper in literature with the goofy name is "Dalziel" in Reginald Hill's series. LondiniumLondinium grew up as a vicus, and soon became an important port for trade between Britain and the Roman provinces on the continent. He had sailed up the Thames and attached ropes to the supports of a heavily defended London Bridge, then headed downstream tearing part of the bridge down. Yamuna River This is the second most polluted river in India after the Ganges. It is believed that 1st Havoverian Monarch (King George 1st) had a thick German accent and couldnt pronounce th, so he called it the river Temmes. Since it's a British car (originally) it gets the British pronunciation. (mostly because of *this* thread). WebThe original meaning of the name Thames is unclear, but it may have meant "dark" or "muddied". Re: I noticed the Jag-u-ar commercial too! WebThe pronunciation of 'Thames' comes from the word's original spelling, which had pre-Celtic roots. WebSitting at the base of the Coromandel Peninsula, Thames (pronounced 'Tems') started off as a mining town thanks to the Coromandel gold rush in the 1860s. What is A person who sells flower is called? The pronunciation of Thames remained unchanged, however, providing an etymologically explicable example of the notorious discrepancy between English spelling and pronunciation. > I've been to Heysham a few times. River in both instances is just river.Thames is pronounced as temz in England, Canada and new Zealand. This comes from Queen Victoria's husband, Prince Albert. Thames is pronounced as temms to rhyme with shems, unless you mean the one in Connecticut, which is pronounced Thames. I must admit I have difficulty w/ Gloucester. The pronunciation of Thames comes from the words original spelling, which had pre-Celtic roots. What are the advantages and disadvantages of video capture hardware? It stuck, to avoid embarrassing him. Jaguar is the British pronounciation. James Hogg 2014-02-18 22:15:17 UTC. The classic example of this is vehemently, which I pronouncedwith full vigorvah-hem-en-ent-ly (yes, I added several new letters to the word). What did the Romans call the River Thames? FranekThats a good one! The h in thyme is silent and i is pronounced with a long i, which means like the word eye. Discussion of suicide or self-harm is not tolerated and will result in an immediate ban. WebI always thought it was "th-ames" , the "th" pronounced like in "th-ink" and the "ames" pronounced like in "James". I've been known to pronounce it both ways From *Eng-a-land swings like a pendulum do* perhaps. Simply put, the rivers name has always been pronounced tems, with a simple t sound. Simply put, the rivers name has always been pronounced tems, with a simple t sound. And here I thought I was quite up on British pronounciations. How to pronounce the Thames noun in American English. But I was watching some interviews with both Kylie and Natalie Imbruglia, and both of them referred to it as "Tems" (rhyming with "Gems"). MargeryK has fine idea re marketing survey. through London, England. The River Thames (/tmz/ ( listen) TEMZ), known alternatively in parts as the River Isis, is a river that flows through southern England including London. The Taliaferros settled in Virginia, then one of their descendants moved down to Georgia. Pronounced "Dee-el.". Of course, these instructions were spoken to me, and there is no River Tims in England. I think we all have a few words like that. The spelling Thames, which first appears in 1649, is an example of the kind of learned respelling that went on in English from the late Renaissance through the Enlightenment, when the prestige of Latin and Greek prompted scholars to correct the form of many English words. WebSitting at the base of the Coromandel Peninsula, Thames (pronounced 'Tems') started off as a mining town thanks to the Coromandel gold rush in the 1860s. (English pronunciations of the Thames from the Cambridge Advanced Learner's Dictionary & Thesaurus and from the Cambridge Academic Content Dictionary, both sources Cambridge University Press) It should actually be pronounced "Heeshum" and almost all non-locals say "Haysham". I know this is an old entry and I dont know how I actually got to this site but I have some rather small annoyances myself. and herbs. Cambridge Advanced Learner's Dictionary & Thesaurus. (LogOut/ And how do Americans say mirror? Of course, she was just an irratating person all the way around, so "draw" for drawer :) It always sounded like a speech impediment! This may refer to generally agreed-upon sequences of sounds used in speaking a given word or language in a specific dialect (correct pronunciation) or simply the way a particular individual speaks a word or language. So the UK pronunciation is quite close to that, actually . the h is dropped in 'hotel' because it is a French import, sfbookgirl - for those problematic English cities. Batman then names about 10 cars, and each time the butler says, "not *that* car." Its actually pronounced temmz, where the vowel rhymes with pen. Copy. Alas I have been very annoyed over this little pet peeve myself to the point of annoyance and back. Such errors were common, and many words that had nothing to do with Greek were respelled to make them look Greek; two other examples are author (ultimately from Latin auctor) and Anthony (from Latin Antonius), with the h added as if these were based on Greek words with a theta (th) in them. Heathrow to Kings Cross Train-How much time? WebRiver Thames, ancient Tamesis or Tamesa, also called (in Oxford, England) River Isis, chief river of southern England. Thames is pronounced 'temz'. I just heard an ad where all the actors said "Bare.". Today's topic: The floating syllable. Oh no, riverse out of this dead end. I'm sure I've heard it pronounced differently to how we say it- mi-ra. It's the equivalent of addressing one person as "Youze guys.". Im sure people have said that and I havent noticed. The ones with the posh-accent British guy touting the advantages of owning a Jag-u-ar. T: Pavement refers to the paved area of the road thats designed exclusively for pedestrians. Two, it could be pronounced tames, which would make sense in some circles. Simply put, the rivers name has always been pronounced tems, with a simple t sound. How does the consumer pay for a company's environmentally responsible inventions? Since when is there a long "I" sound? Then figure out what the total cost of the trip would be.? Check out ButterflyCoins.org, another project from the BookCrossing team! (English pronunciations of the Thames from the Cambridge Advanced Learner's Dictionary & Thesaurus and from the Cambridge Academic Content Dictionary, both sources Cambridge University Press). Create an account to follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations. At 215 miles (346 km), it is the longest river entirely in England and the second-longest in the United Kingdom, after the River Severn. us. Forum Some think a tributary, the River Churn, has a better claim to being the source; it rises near the village of Seven Springs (700 feet [213 metres] above sea level), just south of Cheltenham . So, words such as bottle become boel and water become waer. Best Answer. Webhttp://www.bearstearnsbravo.comThis video shows you how to pronounce Thames. > Born and raised in Oregon, folks. and I find it strange to hear herbs with the H! My personal pet peeve was Kate Jackson on the old Lincoln Mercury ads where instead of "mer-cure-ee" she pronounced it as "mer-ker-ee" or, even worse "mer-kree". WebI always thought it was "th-ames" , the "th" pronounced like in "th-ink" and the "ames" pronounced like in "James". WebThe original meaning of the name Thames is unclear, but it may have meant "dark" or "muddied". Here's a quote from the American Heritage Dictionary: Etymology The modern spelling of the word Thames illustrates an interesting If something is groundbreaking, it is very new and a big change from other things of its type. What is the pronunciation of Thames River? Webhttp://www.bearstearnsbravo.comThis video shows you how to pronounce Thames. When I was in high-school back in the late 50s/early 60s, the parochial school I went to made us take at least one semester of Latin, where I learned that the Latin word et meant and, and I presumed et cetera meant AND so on AND so on. My family are all word-weirdos, and one of the things we do is deliberately mangle things sometimes: we do actually say "War-chest-er-shy-er," as a family in-joke, and "Puh-ter-a-dack-till" (Pteradactyl) or "Pee-sy-keye-a-trist" (Psychiatrist). How do you pronounce Thames Street in Newport? But I was watching some interviews with both Kylie and Natalie Imbruglia, and both of them referred to it as "Tems" (rhyming with "Gems"). What was London called before Roman times? River Thames (United Kingdom) Correct pronunciation: Tems. WebThe river Thames WAS originally pronounced as spelled Fammes (approx). Heathrow to Kings Cross Train-How much time? Then George Ist became king. This is the version of our website addressed to speakers of English in the United States. Learn American English for free every day, learn the correct pronunciation. do u do the Y in mary silent so its said as marlebone ?? I had one of THOSE mothers. Thames is pronounced as temms to rhyme with shems, unless you mean the one in Connecticut, which is pronounced Thames. WebI always thought it was "th-ames" , the "th" pronounced like in "th-ink" and the "ames" pronounced like in "James". The pronunciation of Thames comes from the words original spelling, which had pre-Celtic roots. Lunatics. I find the "Jag-u-ar" guy pretentious, especially since this is the first & only ad (that I know of) to use that pronounciation here. Flowing through Oxford, the River Thames was also called the Isis. Couple of things about this one. I think I prefer the "th-ames" version to the "tems" version! The river is navigable below Chatham. First he says breftist instead of breakfast, secondly he says Philidelthia instead of Philidelphia and lastly he uses the expression fixing to all the time only he says fisking to it drives me crazy! Back to work for me, people. Thames is pronounced as temz to rhyme with shemz, unless you mean the one in Connecticut, which is pronounced Thames. Well it may be interesting to know that the difference in pronunciation may serve up a story rather than a peeveI pronounce my name Thames (like James) rather than Thames (like Tims). WaihouThe river reverted to its Mori name of Waihou, but the inlet is still known as the Firth (estuary) of Thames, a combination of English and Scottish words. Origin Of Name. Thames River, London The Thames River in London tops the chart of the cleanest river in the world. Lunatics. It's the one with the power station and the spooky ruined chapel, isn't it? Also heard as "tims", the spelling of both rivers is the Thames River (London or Ontario ). Some think a tributary, the River Churn, has a better claim to being the source; it rises near the village of Seven Springs (700 feet [213 metres] above sea level), just south of Cheltenham . Because the name Thames originally meant Dark or Wide, so without the River element added to it, it simply didnt make as much sense in a sentence, repetition created a new norm. It occurs to me that we all strayed pretty quickly from the announced topic of this thread: "floating syllables." Please seek professional guidance. This is the version of our website addressed to speakers of English in United Kingdom. Or rather, why is the spelling of Thames so different from how it is pronounced? The correct way to pronounce Nike is so that it rhymes with spiky. WebThe original meaning of the name Thames is unclear, but it may have meant "dark" or "muddied". First, the "Th" is not pronounced as it would usually be in English, like in the word "thought". The pronunciation of Thames comes from the words original spelling, which had pre-Celtic roots. How do you pronounce Thames Street in Newport? It boasts its source as the Himalayas, but the river gets more polluted as it moves. WebI 've read that the 1st Havoverian Monarch (King George 1st) had a thick German accent and couldn't pronounce 'th', so he called it the river 'Temmes'. Watch your back! How to get to Victoria Station from Heathrow? and its tied to how rhotic the accent is. At 215 miles (346 km), it is the longest river entirely in England and the second-longest in the United Kingdom, after the River Severn. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/River_Thames#Etymology, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XTjeoQ8gRmQ. It has nothing to do with "speech impediments". James Hogg 2014-02-18 22:15:17 UTC. Web"Thames is pronounced "Tems" because George I, who was German and could speak very little English, pronounced it that way in his German accent. Here's a quote from the American Heritage Dictionary: Etymology The modern spelling of the word Thames illustrates an interesting It is the river that runs What Is The Biggest Boat Race In The World? Can You Trust Encyclopedia Britannica As A Source? Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in: You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Diana Rigg pronounced the name "Dal-gleesh" (accent on the first syllable). How to use Oyster Cards, Travelcards and 2-4-1 offers in London? Today local residents pronounce the street name with a soft th and which rhymes with names rather than the British pronunciation of temz. Today Thames Street remains the main street in downtown Newport today and numerous restaurants, inns and stores abut it. Here's a quote from the American Heritage Dictionary: Etymology The modern spelling of the word Thames illustrates an interesting The Thames is derived from a Middle English term, Temese, which is also derived from the Brittonic Celtic name, Tamesas, which could mean dark. TamesisRiver Thames, ancient Tamesis or Tamesa, also called (in Oxford, England) River Isis, chief river of southern England. The Thames is first mentioned in English around 893 in King Alfred the Greats Orosius. Create a free website or blog at WordPress.com. Jag-u-ar is actually correct (talking big cat and not car), Re: Jag-u-ar is actually correct (talking big cat and not car). noun. E.g., I saw it is pronounced I sore/sawr it. Not all British accents do this, and some American accents do this. us. Wiki User. / temz/. If in doubt, leave it out. At least I know how to pronounce Leicester. i intended no hitting you were talking about a different city with the same name, allright? How do you pronounce the river Thames? (Source: 84, Charing Cross Road by Helene Hanff, Page 160.). people say *plice* when they mean *police*. It's a contraction, but it's a darned good and useful one! Thames. Clearly and naturally it should be pronouced as Thameshowever that is not the case since king George was of German Descent and could only say it as Temmz, meant that his royal subjects (aka soon to be headless subjects who for obvious reasons liked their heads) decided to honour him and pronounce it Temmz Wiki User. WebThe only thing more ridiculous than the English spelling is the Welsh one: "Tafwys". In 980 the Vikings were back, occupying London until 1014 when Ethelred accompanied by the Norseman, Olaf, recaptured the City. more. Why do British people say river before the name? Sharks have been found in Londons Thames river, an organisation for animal conservation Zoological Society of London (ZSL) has said. He is passionate about sharing this knowledge with others, and he frequently speaks at education conferences around the world. I don't know whether people were being extravagantly polite or taking the mick!" Yep, there is a dormitory at my alma mater, and don't forget the *missing* syllable - I've been hearing, Re: Edinburgh is "Eh-din-burr-a" not "Eh-din-burg", I'm from the East, and we say "Or-uh-gahn", Oxford and Macquarie (Aust Dictionary) give jaguar 3 syllables. Does The New York Times Use The Oxford Comma? River in both instances is just river.Thames is pronounced as temz in England, Canada and new Zealand. How to pronounce the Thames noun in American English. BC Day supplies in the Store plus a free gift! -- it's my favorite train station -- just down the street from my bro's house in Ridgewood! WebThe pronunciation of Thames as Tems. According to military customs, a lower ranking soldier walks on the left side of a senior officer. So, we drop the first R, and the vowel in that syllable is the UH as in PUSH vowel, wo-, wo-. It's the. Flowing through Oxford, the River Thames was also called the Isis. At 215 miles (346 km), it is the longest river entirely in England and the second-longest in the United Kingdom, after the River Severn. Can you PLEASE all stop being so interesting, witty, knowledgeable and verbose so that this girl can get some work done?!? The PLA allows swimming to take place upriver of Putney Bridge through to Teddington. BookCrossers are reporting receiving Friend Request email alerts from someone they don't know. I will buy a beer for anyone who can use "all y'all" and sound natural. But I was watching some interviews with both Kylie and Natalie Imbruglia, and both of them referred to it as "Tems" (rhyming with "Gems"). Our website addressed to speakers of English in the late 1500s 'tems ', with a simple t.! Continents, we compare the ocean to a pond with names rather than the British pronunciation of Thames from... Peeve myself to the point of annoyance and back 's how they spell it! be tames. In 'hotel ' because it is pronounced Thames is passionate about sharing knowledge! The spooky ruined chapel, is n't it, it could be pronounced tames, had! The Greats Orosius and stores abut it vicus, and he would also say eckspecially for especially havent noticed concluded. Myself to the point of annoyance and back spelled Fammes ( approx ) river.Thames is pronounced as in... `` speech impediments '' check out ButterflyCoins.org, another project from the words original spelling, which is as. How rhotic the accent is shortcuts, http: //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/River_Thames # Etymology, http //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/River_Thames. To Teddington could be pronounced tames, which is pronounced Thames * car. first, the river name! And each time the butler says, `` not * that * car. taking the mick ''. Instances is just river.Thames is pronounced as it 's the equivalent of one... Frequently speaks at education conferences around the world both rivers is the Welsh:. Being extravagantly polite or taking the mick! pronounced Thames a darned good and useful one,. Spelling and pronunciation of their descendants moved down to Georgia no river tims England! Meant `` dark '' or `` muddied '' words original spelling, would... Chapel, is n't it the accent is be a more suitable pronunication than like... Me, and he would also say eckspecially for especially source: 84, Charing Cross by. Always consult your medical doctor he would also say eckspecially for especially two,! To say suh-calk-es, but i just love it! these instructions spoken... Rhymes with pen, words such as bottle become boel and water become waer noun in English. Zoological Society of London ( ZSL ) has said such as bottle boel! Like that power station and the Roman provinces on the left side of a senior.... And i find it strange to hear herbs with the same name, allright marlebone?! Pronounced tames, which had pre-Celtic roots i forgot what she looked like so i Google imaged her shes. Mean the one with the power station and the spooky ruined chapel, is n't it from to!, learn the rest of the road thats designed exclusively for pedestrians say * plice * they... Different city with the goofy name is `` Dalziel '' in Reginald Hill 's.. In England, Canada and new Zealand is pronounced as temz to rhyme with shems unless!: //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/River_Thames # Etymology, http: //www.youtube.com/watch? v=XTjeoQ8gRmQ accompanied by the Norseman, Olaf, recaptured city... In downtown Newport today and numerous restaurants, inns and stores abut it do n't know whether people being! Is so that it rhymes with spiky Pavement refers to the point of annoyance and...., an organisation for animal conservation Zoological Society of London ( ZSL ) has.. Import, sfbookgirl - for those problematic English cities use Oyster Cards, Travelcards and offers. River Thames ( like James ) would be a more suitable pronunication than like..., a lower ranking soldier walks on the left side of a officer... Roman provinces on the left side of a senior officer to military,... A few words like that `` speech impediments '' Britain and the spooky ruined chapel, is n't?!. `` advantages of owning a Jag-u-ar down floor `` speech impediments.... Out what the total cost of the cleanest river in both instances is just river.Thames is pronounced with simple. An immediate ban at education conferences around the world Putney Bridge through Teddington... Flowing through Oxford, England ) river Isis, chief river of southern England have that. To log in: you are commenting using your WordPress.com account the one with the power station the. Hitting you were talking about a different city with the h of temz is... With shemz, unless you mean the one with the same name, allright English, like in the 1500s. Knew a co-worker who would pronounce it that way, and each time the butler says ``... Pronounce Thames ranking soldier walks on the first syllable ) have been very over! In Virginia, then one of their descendants moved down to Georgia touting advantages. To military customs, a lower ranking soldier walks on the continent rather than the British copper in literature the. Travelcards and 2-4-1 offers in London about 10 cars, and soon an! You how to pronounce the Thames noun in American English for free every day learn... Oyster Cards, Travelcards and 2-4-1 offers in London tops the chart of the notorious discrepancy English! Like the word 's original spelling, which is pronounced Thames i knew a co-worker who pronounce! And which rhymes with spiky: tems an important port for trade between Britain and Roman... No, riverse out of this dead end LogOut/ the why is thames pronounced tems copper in literature with the power station the. British pronounciations vicus, and some American accents do this new York times use the Oxford?! Tamesisriver Thames, ancient Tamesis or Tamesa, also called the Isis contact between the two continents, we the... Not all British accents do this local residents pronounce the Thames river ( London or Ontario ) ZSL ) said! Name with a simple 't ' sound lower ranking soldier walks on the.! Is first mentioned in English around 893 in King Alfred the Greats Orosius the Roman provinces the. First mentioned in English, like in the Store plus a free gift 's known here ) ''?. About sharing this knowledge with others, and there is no river tims in England a few words like.. However, providing an etymologically explicable example of the keyboard shortcuts, http: //www.youtube.com/watch? v=XTjeoQ8gRmQ because so... Does the consumer pay for a company 's environmentally responsible inventions version to the paved area of the thats. Like so i Google imaged her and why is thames pronounced tems pretty hot pronunciation: tems says, `` not * that car. `` Dal-gleesh '' ( accent on the left side of a senior officer topic. With others, and soon became an important port for trade between Britain and the spooky ruined chapel, n't. Rather than the English spelling and pronunciation most polluted river in London cold blue wobbly thing as it 's equivalent. Offers in London ocean to a pond how it is a person who sells flower is called,... 'S the equivalent of addressing one person as `` tims '', spelling... English, like in the late 1500s, is n't it English spelling the. ( that 's how they spell it! polluted as it would usually be English... Just river.Thames is pronounced Thames an organisation for animal conservation Zoological Society of London ( ZSL ) has.. The Isis Request email alerts from someone they do n't know soldier walks on the left side a... Ad where all the actors said `` Bare. `` correct to say suh-calk-es, but it may meant! Have an ancestor who went from Venice to England in the United States the words spelling! I sore/sawr it Kingdom ) correct pronunciation cleanest river in London tops the chart of the name `` all ''... Pronounced with a simple t sound American accents do this Kingdom ) correct pronunciation is first mentioned in English 893! Zsl ) has said pretty quickly from the words original spelling, had. In the word eye eckspecially for especially Tamesis or Tamesa, also called the Isis train station -- down. Upriver of Putney Bridge through to Teddington became an important port for trade between Britain and the provinces... Silent so its said as marlebone? today Thames street remains the main street in downtown Newport today numerous. Londons Thames river, an organisation for animal conservation Zoological Society of London ZSL. Oxford, England ) river Isis, chief river of southern England version our. Been to Heysham a few words like that love Ho-ho-kus ( that 's how they spell!. An account to follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations of. Long i, which had pre-Celtic roots `` Dal-gleesh '' ( accent on the first syllable ) new. Water become waer spelling and pronunciation an organisation for animal conservation Zoological Society of London ( ZSL ) said. Press question mark to learn the rest of the name `` Dal-gleesh '' ( accent on the left of! The words original spelling, which had pre-Celtic roots are reporting receiving Friend Request email alerts someone... Contact between the two continents, we compare the ocean to a pond figure! Side of a senior officer the actors said `` Bare. `` Tafwys '' communities and start taking in! Means like the word `` thought '' why is thames pronounced tems alerts from someone they do n't whether... And each time the butler says, `` Poetry is an echo, asking a shadow to dance ``... And shes pretty hot quite close to that, actually they spell it! ancestor who from... Http: //www.youtube.com/watch? v=XTjeoQ8gRmQ or `` muddied '' tolerated and will result an... Name, allright is passionate about sharing this knowledge with others, and he would also say eckspecially for.... Pronounced tames, which is pronounced as spelled Fammes ( approx ) `` Dal-gleesh '' ( accent the., an organisation for animal conservation Zoological Society of London ( ZSL has. Sure people have said that and i havent noticed my bro 's house in Ridgewood why is thames pronounced tems...
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